Unless the news comes back that Oceanic 815 was found and all passengers were alive, I am not buying any information on the REAL Oceanic 815. If the report is that everyone is dead, then that could simply be a well executed cover up. There were only 50 some-odd survivors on a plane of 324 passengers and crew. Chances are they wouldn't find pieces of everyone, but still declare the entire passenger list dead.

Dude, I seriously hope so because if this is an attempt to recreate "What's in the hatch" or "What caused the crash", they are in serious serious trouble with the fans. The information has to tie in with all the time travel stuff. I'm sure it will, and I'm sure you're right in some way. It fits with the "Who are we?" spoiler.

Yeah, I'd guess that she tells them that 815 was found with no survivors, and that this was part of a coverup by the Others. It would answer why no one is looking for them / has found them after almost three months. Like everything on Lost, a new mystery is actually just a piece of the answer to other mysteries. This jives with what Doc Jensen wrote in his column on Thursday about Naomi telling them something "deadly" about 815.

So no, it's nothing that weird. Not Desmond-goes-back-in-time weird, at least.

Remember though, Ben and the others saw the crash. I still think the plane was supposed to land (Ben knew this), but the island got to it first. Maybe it fits in with the box somehow, like the plane was empty (besides the crew who were in on it; this would explain Cindy and Smokey snatching the pilot right away) and the 815ers were taken from the box for reasons not yet known...

I hope it turns out that the plane was never found (maybe just some pieces) and all passengers are presumed dead, but the twist is that three years have passed in the "real world." El Prez and I would be vindicated for all our going on and on about time moving slower (if at all) on Snow Globe Island. It would fit into the LOST m/o of answering questions and opening new ones through those answers...

Here is something to add. Remember Michael and Walt got off the island. What could they have told people. Did Michael and Walt actually MAKE IT? If Michael had the heart to tell people that there were still survivors (if he is determined to cover up the shooting of Ana -Lucia and Libby), wouldn't they start looking for the Losties again? Just a thought...

I'm just going to stay quiet on this whole thing, but Doc, I am right there with you, brother...

I gotta say that I love the heck outta what you all are hatin' against. I remember back in 9th grade that I wanted to see a show that did this very thing - SERIOUSLY! Thanks to Lost, I got my wish.

I love the way they write this show. Sorry. Sue me!

OK everybody, here's the explanation. I'm right on this.

She's going to tell them something along the lines of Oceanic 815 crashed and everyone onboard died. Period. Not missing, not unknown, we're talking DEAD BODIES.

And here's the explanation of how this is possible:

Desmond changed the past.

Here's how this will be revealed:

Jack's flashbacks in the finale (why else bother with Jack flashbacks?).

Follow me on this...

Desmond and Penny broke up very differently in "Flashes Before Your Eyes" than they did originally. Yes? We already have proof of that in the show... two copies of the photograph, when only one should exist.

Here is what we will see through Jack's flashbacks in the finale:

Desmond and Penny will have a very different argument outside the stadium while Jack runs up and down the steps (or no argument at all). Desmond will give Jack a different pep talk, or will be absent. Jack hurt his foot there... without Desmond's help, he'll be late back to the hospital.

Jack's dad will have already broken the news to Sarah that she can walk. Jack and Sarah will not share that moment.

Jack won't marry Sarah.

Jack's dad won't sleep with Sarah (not for sure that he did in the first place, but I think so, after all, he called Ana Lucia Sarah, didn't he?).

Jack's dad will have one less thing to feel guilty about when he goes on his bender in Australia.

Jack will reach his father in time. No dead dad.

Jack only got on Oceanic 815 due to his sob story about burying his father. No sob story, no flight that day.

Final flashback... Jack and his dad flying back to the US on September 23, 2004.

So to answer a previous hint as to the major question the 'Losties' should be asking... "Who Are We?". Well, we know who they are not... the survivors of Oceanic 815, because THERE WEREN'T ANY.

I figure some of them got on the flight in the 'new' timeline, some didn't, I dunno. There are loose ends in my theory, but it makes a lot of things make sense, and has no direction contradictions.

Have at.

Doc, I wouldn't think true fans would be swayed by the negative press if your scenario plays out. Given the number of major questions I expect we will have answered within the next month, LOST wouldn't be LOST unless they leave us with a new MAJOR mystery...or eight. Also, how about this possibility:
Hurley (to Naomi): "We're the survivors of Oceanic 815."
Naomi: "How long have you been here?"
Hurley: "Dude, like four months."
Naomi: "Then you couldn't be the survivors of 815."
Hurley: "Well...why...not?"
Naomi: "Because the REAL flight 815 disapeared three years ago."
Okay, everything is cool...just confirming the time anomoly we've always suspected...nothing more...no sharks in sight.
Cap10: When I was reading your comments about the plane and the box I had a flash of Kate taking the toy plane out of the safety deposit box. Perhaps more foreshadowing we didn't see coming?

Game changer time!!!
I'm with Gusteaux and the good Cap10....Kate's toy plane in a time capsule??? Effing genius, gusteaux!!! it all fits perfectly with the different time anomolies. It explains the satelite phone being current, hell, even the washer and dryer in the hatch...The real kicker will be Walt coming back to the island, not Michael...
By the way, the cast list came back for man behind the curtain: I swear, if Uncle Rico is Ben's dad, I'm going to vote for Pedro!!

Thank you, El Prez. And I agree with your Walt returning without Michael. Michael can't come back because he killed Libby and Ana in cold blood. Walt wants to rescue those they left behind AND retreive Vincent. This obviously will also cover Walt's growth and aging. And it could even cover Darlton's butts if they can't lure Harold P. back.

Isn't there a problem with the "time moving slower here" theory? Ben showed Juliet video of her sister with her young son. If the video was live, wouldn't the kid have been older or wouldn't Juliet have at least noticed that the kid was too old based on the time she had been on the island?

Yeah the whole time moving differently on the island doesn't make sense....We are shown that Desmond met Jack 3 years prior to the island and he set Jack's future in motion by giving him a pep talk about miracles. Not to mention we were shown that soon after the crash Mikhail was watching the news on Oceanic Flight 815 and how it went missing so how could time be running differently?

Unless....Mikhail was watching archive footage of Flight 815 and how it went missing but the footage is 3 years old?

Perhaps time was flowing normally untl Desmond turned the key.

Baker and Muscle_Bob -
Someone posted at around 3:00am what the timezone difference would be, I rewatched the episode, because I couldn't get back to sleep, and figured out the timeline.

The crashed happened at 4:16pm island time. the plane turned back to Fiji according to the pilot, so it could have gotten as far as Hawaii, then doubled back. Compensated an hour for the time it took to walk to the flame. If indeed the footage was live, it would have been anywhere between 9:30pm to 2:00am. It would have been dark if indeed it was live footage. Archived footage would have been more than plausible.

That scene does not disprove any time anomaly.

@Tabula Rasa

You forget that the footage Mikhail was watching was of the plane taking off from Sydney Airport which corresponds with the daylight.

What I mean by archive footage, assuming their is a time anomoly, is that we saw in "One of Us" Mikhail watching the Oceanic news coverage. Instead of that being live coverage it would be a tape or something considering the Others would be well aware of a time discrepancy. That would explain the look on Ben's face. People speculate he was expecting the crash but I bet he was figuring out in his head when this plane came from.

I really think this is getting to be jump the shark time.

There is, of course, another angle. As long as we're assuming divergent timelines, what's to say the plane crashes at all? Maybe it lands in LA with everybody aboard. Thus Charlie's quip: If those guys are us, then "Who are we?"

Don't know why Penny would still be looking for her beau in this scenario, of course. Just thinking out loud.

Everyone is always talking about Time-line.
Time-Travel, Time running different on the Island.
When the Show Runners have already stated.
There is no Time-Travel.
There is no Supernatural. They Have said, Everything could be exlplained By Scientific Means.

naomi arrived pretty much at the same time as henry-gale "fell from the sky" last season. do u think it's the writer's way of introducing a new group aka team dharma?

i like the "impregnated memories" theory, but we've seen the plane falling from the sky at least twice, and not in a personal memory.

and time travel (ore more likely, split time) can be explained in the lost universe, if you see as science fiction. i mean, look at smokey...

Any one every thought that Namoi just might be lying about flight 815?

Why are we so quick to believe what she says anyway?

Why are we assuming she's going to say flight 815 landed in L.A.? And if she does say that, why would she lie? Penny sent her, right?
In regards to split timelines, alternate realities and such not being scientific...um, they made it clear Desmond traveled in time and can see the future, so why are some people putting their fingers in their ears and going, "Nah nah nah nah nah, can't hear you, nah nah nah nah nah"?

I thought there was no time travel as well, but Desmond threw that out the window. He has experienced or created several timelines right in front of us. Charlies gets an arrow to the throat in one of them, then Desmond travels BACK IN TIME to create a different result in another.

Hey Conni. They have rescinded the 'explainable by science' means. You have to also consider what that even means. Explaining something by science merely means that the events would test true by the laws of the universe. Since this is a story, it only needs to test true in the universe of the show, where they are free to create whatever laws they want to justify their explanation. Not to mention that science does actually provide the mechanical rudiments for virtually any story. However, that is neither here nor there. Read the next to last question in this interview: http://www.thetailsection.com/lost-news/jeff-jensen-of-ew-talks-lost-p-1.php

Merlboroman: there's always the possibility Penny's father sent Naomi.

Not to ruin the theory of the islands time being slower than real world time but Desmond and Jack met several years before they met again on the island and Desmond was on the island for around 3 years. At a 4 month on island time to 3 years on real world time that would make Jack about 27 years older than Desmond when they met on the island and im pretty sure they looked as if they aged in the same amount of time. So the only way the island could have a slower time is when Des turned the key it suddenly made time on the island slower which would be like a 1 month to 3 years ratio...... ?? any opinons? ?

You're all forgetting one piece of the puzzle: one of the flight attendants is now one of the Others. Remember? Jack noticed her and conversed with her when he was in the cage on Alcatraz island.

My theory is that the flight that crashed on the island was a bogus flight, staffed by people who were connected to some group that knew about the island. I think it was supposed to land there (which is why the plane was so low), but then Desmond's failure to hit the button caused it to crash instead. The "real" Oceanic 815 was empty and crashed somewhere, "killing" everyone on board. It's the simplest explanation and it doesn't involve crazy time travel conspiracies.

This is from spoilerfix today.....

From spoilerfix

"04/24 - Site visitor Matt sent us information about what Naomi will tell the survivors about Flight 815: [highlight if you want to be that spoiled..."At the close of the episode our beloved cast aways will inform the parachute girl that they're survivors of Oceanic flight 815. The parachute girl will give them the unfortunate news that what they've just told her is impossible seeing as how the wreckage of that flight was found and recovered, and that there were no survivors. The episode promptly ends thereafter."] Source: SpoilerFix.com"

^I was just gonna post that...
Now how the **** are the creators gonna explain that?
God I am so friggin mad!!!

Let's look at the facts to dismiss a couple ideas.

Naomi is not going to tell people "You can't be the survivors of Oceanic 815... that plane landed safely!"

I mean, who knows when a plane lands safely?? That's not news.

As for the Others carefully constructing an elaborate ruse to secretly bring the Oceanic people to the island and put them in a fake plane wreck... why would anyone really think that? I'm not trying to be rude, but look at what this show typically does. We learn the answers to questions we have, but rarely do they do ANYTHING in that show that contradicts what has gone before. They like to show us that people's motivations were not what we thought, but they rarely (if ever) show us that EVENTS were not what we thought. They have also gone to great lengths this year to show us that the Others are not all powerful people. They have limitations. I mean, I think they showed the plane crash at the beginning of the season to show us IT REALLY CRASHED. And that the Others did NOT cause it. I mean, Desmond caused it, and it was an accident.

I'm telling you... Naomi is from the new timeline, in which the plane crashed differently (how, I dunno), and everyone died. Some of our survivors were on the plane and are dead in the 'real' world, others aren't. The rest of the season will be a mix of battle versus Others and figuring out what this means. Heck, the battle versus the Others may result from some people realizing there's no home to go to.

I have no idea why they'd believe Naomi, by the way. I doubt she has any proof of what she says. She's on the island for Desmond, not them... she knows about the crash the same way the average well read person knows about any major event from 3 months ago. This also helps dissuade anyone thinking time travels differently... it's VERY unlikely Naomi would remember a random plane crash from "years" ago, but 3 months ago is believable.

Well that explains why noone is looking for them but it gives us more questions and mysteries needing to be solved.

Like how the hell did they find wreckage of a plane with no survivors when the plane wreckage is all over the island and the survivors are on the island as well??

Was it all a setup by the others? Did they have anything to do with the other plane ??

Alternate time theories??

Its going to be interesting to hear everyones theorys on this new discovery. Looking forward to it.

Heres one the others might not have had any connection to flight 815 crashing on the island but they wouldn't want people searching for the survivors in case they found the island. They have alot of very high connections with people who could easily get enough money to purchase a plane and paint it within a day or so to make it look like oceanic flight 815 and then crash it in a far enough away from the island but in a spot it wouldve been flying over to make people beleive that the flight did indeed crash. Just a thought

I think its a safe Bet to say this is the Game-Changer

Question: I recall you having an interview with somebody associated with Lost and talking about a "game changing" episode where we'll be blown away and everything will be turned on its head. Has this episode already aired? I sure hope not. — Chad
Ausiello: That "somebody" would be Damon Lindelof, and no, it hasn't aired yet. My hunch is it's the aforementioned May 2 episode, since it was penned by Darlton (aka Damon and Carlton).
source: Ask Ausiello

whats to say she is telling the truth and dont like the diffrent timeline etc idea buts its growing on me of thats what it might be I really hope it aint that though. If she is telling the truth here is another theory what if they have set up another plane crash site so no one is looking for them so no one can find the island because of what the island is etc.

Here is something to back that theory up when Penny and her guys where looking for the island it seemed it had all sorts stopping it from being found.

any thoughts welcome.

Perhaps it was all covered up in some way. Hanso/ Dharma must have some kind of govermental funding or backing....???

Please, everyone, get off the time thing. If Lost is stupid enough to actually make this about "timelines" and vague nonsense like that, then nobody will watch next season. THERE ARE NO SEPARATE TIMELINES. Please get off this nonsense.

How about we all just let the story play out and quit acting like we own it? If you don't want to watch then don't watch, but it's their story, so how about we let them tell it?

You guys are all forgetting that the Others are well connected. They were able to leave the island at will and had a lot of resources. I bet they just convinced the outside world that there were no survivors so that no one would come looking for them and stumble upon the island. Remember, moments after the crash they already had the flight # and were working on detailed files of all passengers and crew. Who's to say they didn't use the sub to drag out the tail section and fuselage far enough away from the island so that it would be found and all passengers would be presumed dead?

to Muscle_Bob_Buff_Pants:

I think there is a critical flaw in your reasoning: we have no evidence that any Other has ever left the island. The only indication that anyone can leave is Ben's words, and, well... we've seen how truthful Ben can be.

Until we actually see someone leave, I don't think we can assume that anyone can. (And no, we do not have evidence that Richard Alpert has left the island since arriving with Juliet.)

"THERE ARE NO SEPARATE TIMELINES."

I am not wedded to any particular theory (especially the plane landing safely one, which I tossed out for completeness sake), but dismissing time as a factor is not possible. Desmond has altered the timeline several times. Just last week we saw two timelines unfold on Lost Island. In the first, Charlie dies by an arrow to the thoat, and in the other, he doesn't. There are two photos where before there were one. Etc, etc.

I hope the show steers clear of the timeline deal other than what Desmond personally experiences, but we have now two (and possibly three) characters who are experiencing time differently than everyone else, so speculation cannot ignore this factor.

I think that Michael and Walt weren't allowed to just go back to their lives. Michael is now in that same mental hospital that Hugo and Libby were in.

People think that 815 crashed hundreds (thousands?) of miles from where it did. Someone might even have planted some wreckage. As far as everyone knows their were no survivors.

No Shark jumping moments, no weird timelines. I am still in denial.

1. There is no TIME DIALATION or anything of the sort. Remember when Ben shows Dr. Juliet a LIVE feed of the outside world.

2. The whole there were no survivors on 815 will be explained. My best guess is that neither DHARMA or the others want the island to be found. The last thing they needed was a plane crashing on the thing. Given their resources, they gave the searchers something to find. She never said every body was recovered. A plane in a blown to a million pieces in the ocean will be presumed to have NO SURVIVORS and will be reported as such.

That's it, keep it simple

[Until we actually see someone leave, I don't think we can assume that anyone can. (And no, we do not have evidence that Richard Alpert has left the island since arriving with Juliet.)]- by mj

wasn't it richard who took the video of juliet's sister?

im just a regular lost-watcher and dont do intense internet discussions normally, but i was curious after the latest episode.. and i dont understand how mikhail is alive.. i also don't think the answer to the story is time travel/ different time lines because as some people have already said, its too difficult to put across...
also, lost is returning for a 4th season according to the writers so the matter wont be resolved by the end of the season hence the dismissal of "oceanic 815 landed safely in an alternate timeline"

paulman, desmond wasn't on the flight 815, so penny would look for his irrespective of anything to do with that plane.

Remember when Rose and her husband whose name escapes me at the moment went to Australia to see a healer. When he talked to Rose he told her that he couldn't heal her, this was not the right place, but there are more "places" like this around the world.What if the island is one of those places? No time difference.Just different and the people of Dharma and now the Others are just exploiting and experimenting with what does and doesn't work on this island.

No Time travel or slower time line here. The survivors of 815 had been watched for a long time before they made it to the island. That would explain the files they have on everyone. Were they selected or did they volunteer? They are all connected to one another somehow. Were they actually in the plane crash? How many people can actually survive a crash like that? Is it real or are they all connected to a type of computer running a single program where they all interact. It could explain how some are healed, the smoke monster, how some can come and go from the island, etc.

Well if Juliet has been on the island for three years
(when the plane crashed down) and her sister was pregnant when she left. That would make the kid 2 years old.Seeing pregnancies are 36 to 42 weeks long.So I don't entirely think that time moves slower on the Island.

Ummm the plane did wash away in season 1 during the high tide....so the plane could've been found with some if the bodies that were stuck in it.

That was a good call Bigg Gee... I agree with your assumption... I am not real sure about Naomi saying that Oceanic 815 crashed 3 years ago... I agree with one of the above statements... "who remember's plane crashes 3 years later? 3 months maybe, but not 3 years" But when we start speculating on alternate timelines and the theories of lost... everyone leaves out season one... " Why did Claire's psychic lie to her about foster parents and put her on flight 815 and tell her that she had to be on "THAT" flight." What did he see? And lets not forget, that after being administered that drug from the others, she was the first one to have baby on the island and not die... and now Sun is pregnant? soooo what was up with her psychic telling her this... throw this question into your lost theories?

Can someone please explain to me how it is that someone can parachute from a helicopter????????? I think Naomi is another mole. Her knowledge of Desmond is simply explained by the others being able to get any information they need. The plane crash report of everyone being dead is a simple cover up so that the Dharma Initiative can continue working.

It is all in Hurley's head...

The Others arrived on the island in the 70's as the Dharma Initative. Their goal was to do controversial experiments for their company that we saw Juliette join.

They were trying to find cures for all sorts of problems such as cancer etc. However there was a incident that nearly destroyed the earth on a mega-scale. It was at this point that Dharma began the coverup, including the cover-up of the island. Unfortunatley somebody had to keep pressing the button every 108 minutes in order to release the magnetic charge. They sent in one of their group to do this, until Desmond arrived at the Island.

Up until this point the others had been living there for all this time in the barracks.
It is around here that Juliette and Richard arrive at the Island.

Juliette was hired because they needed to find out why the women died when pregnant.

Meanwhile, the passengers were being watched while they lived their normal lives and were somehow rounded up to be on this plane together, which was actually not the plane they were supposed to be on. They were put on a plane that was controlled by the others.

The real plane was filled with unknown bodies - or none.
It was then crashed deliberatly while they controlled the full one off course to the island.

It was supposed to land at an unseen-yet airstrip on the island, but desmond was killing one of the others and forgot about the button causing the plane to unexpectedly crash.

Ben was shocked, not because a plane crashed on the island, but simply because it crashed.

He then said there may be survivors and sent the others to the camps as spys, secretly hoping that the doctor had survived as he needed him.

The others begin to kidnap the survivors as they were brought there for reasons the others decided, such as since they didnt have any natural born kids, they decided to import them so to speak, and perhaps the flight attendant was always a part of the others.

The problem occurs when desmond turned the key in the hatch.

the island is actually surrounded by a force field type device that makes it invisible and was put there immediatly after the incident back in the 70's.

How about the possiblity that the huge giant magnet that needed to be discharged every 108 was the mechanical part of the device that shrouded the island from view via an ultra-violet light so that it couldnt be seen. This would explain why the black rock ran into it and why Naomi believed the coordinates were for the middle of the ocean but then claims to have seen land.

This claim of land was only possible however after detonation of the hatch by desmond, becuase locke broke the only way to discharge it. The detonation caused the UV device to shut down, making the sky purple for an instance and then.... land was visible once more. Also the magnetic disturbance was picked up by Penny's team as she was looking for desmond. It had been picked up when the plane crashed but the team had missed it - or so they hinted.

But as to how she knew to look for a magnetic anomaly? who knows?

My guess is that at this point the others knew the island was visible so they quickly tried to get jack to do bens operation before they moved out of the camp they were living for decades and were probably abandoning the island and we are now in the middle of this saga.

There are still many questions however, such as whats the smokey, whats with the giant foot statue, what was the giant eagle, how did all the people heal and how come ben got sick? What happened to Micahel and Walt. Did they actually get set free? How is Michail still alive?

I belive the others have the capability to go back and forth from the island, however ben does not want anyone to do this. This is why he allowed locke to blow up the submarine and then wanted to initate him into their group.

This is why all the things like newish dryer and washer in the hatch and cd players in the barracks existed.

anyway enuff for now - bed time - just rambling