Your Voice: Vincent - Dead or Alive?
Submitted by Ian Robinson
Over the years I have read various theories about how Vincent could actually be the smoke monster, but while reading those theories I never gave them much ground to walk on. Then I actually started thinking about it, and the theory is not as far out as I originally imagined.
First of all, I can (barely) understand how a human would survive that crash, but for a dog to survive is even harder for me to believe. Especially since when we first spot him in the jungle, he is dry. That would mean he would have had to land on the sand. For a dog in a cage to get free on it’s own will, the cage door would need to snap off. In order for this to happen, it is my opinion that the cage would have had to compress, and therefore Vincent surviving is already a question mark.
However, I was watching Lost season 1 again the other night, and it was on the episode where Jack kept seeing his father everywhere (White Rabbit) and I noticed something that I never realized before. Immediately after Jack sees his dad in the water, we see Vincent run up with a ball, soaking wet. But it doesn’t seem like anyone is interested in playing catch with him, so where did he get the ball, and why would he go in the water without a need to? I don’t exactly know how and can’t claim to, but I don’t think Vincent survived the crash. His body is manifested by the smoke monster to keep up appearances.
I know you’re all thinking, "But everyone sees Vincent!" The theory of only one person seeing the dead at any given time was thrown out the window when both Juliet and Jack saw her therapist. Also, we’ve seen what Walt could do (bird died when it flew into the window, polar bear), so it is not entirely out of the question to think that the Island would want to keep him happy. What better way to do this than allow his dog to live?
Anyway, so that one scene got me thinking, and I did some research into other times involving the dog.
First of all, there are his perceptions:
-Barking at the boars signifies an attempt to tell the islanders about food.
-Taking the blanket off Nikki and Paulo, because they weren’t dead.
-Barking at Sun and Michael before they almost kiss.
-Running past Jack,Kate, et al during season 3 to avoid Locke’s group from being detected.
Then there are the other strange moments:
-Doesn’t seem to warn Sun before she is attacked by Charlie, despite being in the area.
-Brings Charlie the virgin Mary, knowing it would take him to the rest and taunt him.
-When Shannon runs after Vincent, he disappears, but she sees Walt, and is subsequently shot.
-Before we see the ‘polar bear’, Vincent runs off into the reeds, disappears, and then the polar bears emerges. What is interesting about this is it seems that Vincent is able to bark at boars, but when there’s a polar bear around, he runs toward the problem and isn’t heard from.
I may be out on a limb, but I don’t think everything is right with Vincent. Especially in those few scenes, he seems to be in the vicinity of things that are about to go wrong a little too often.
If you look back from Season 1 to Season 4, try to match up all the times that we see the smoke monster (or apparitions) and Vincent at the same time. There aren’t any. In fact, many times he is focused on, and then runs off before the smoke monster makes an appearance. Furthermore, twice in the first five episodes he is around Christian Shephard (Lost Missing Pieces before Jack opens his eyes, and ‘in the water’) though we know that Christian Shephard should be dead. He is also around before Shannon sees ‘Walt’ (though Walt is off island at this point).
That’s all I’ve got for now. Is Vincent dead or alive?
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Unfortunately the producers have already let us know via podcasts that Harper (Therapist) is not dead, and was alive when Juliet and Jack ran into her.
Comment by Bad_Robot — May 20, 2008 @ 7:55 am
I realise after that it was a mistake saying it like that. But one thing the producers never said is whether or not she was actually there when they ran into her. She might be alive, but I would still love to see ANYONE disappear that quickly.
Comment by Ian Robinson — May 20, 2008 @ 8:24 am
If they (the Others) are able to send messages via smokey, the character can be alive, but not actually be there in the same essence. Does that make sense? Sorry, I should have worded that differently, as she is not dead
Comment by Ian Robinson — May 20, 2008 @ 8:27 am
Or maybe Vincent is Jacob…
Comment by Hansend — May 20, 2008 @ 9:36 am
Ooo…good point on the vincent is jacob thing….I don’t know what there is to support it, but I like the sound of it….and what about the fact that Ben seems to be able to control Smokey to some point (as he unleashed it on the Freighter Fighters)….does that mean that he controls Vincent? Or the smokey-vincent apparition?
Comment by landryb — May 20, 2008 @ 10:30 am
There’s no question in my mind that Vincent is “special,” but it’s far from clear where his special characteristics come from.
One of the intriguing scenes I noticed when re-viewing S1 was when Locke is showing Walt how to throw a knife, advising him to visualize the end result, there are quick edits showing Vincent looking at Walt, then at the target, then Walt making a perfect throw. My interpretation is that Vincent was helping Walt to perform this “young padawan” task, not unlike Obiwan and Luke practicing with the blast-helmet in the Millenium Falcon.
It would be interesting to go back to the off-island scene with Walt and the book on wildlife and the bird that flies into the window, to see if there is a similar implied connection with Vincent that helps that to happen. Since this happened off-island and long before 2004, it would put Vincent in a role like Alpert or Abbadon - one of those who can leave the island when needed to perform an important recruiting/educational task.
One aside - I missed how Vincent returned to the island after clearly leaving from the ferry dock with Michael and Walt in a boat at the end of S2. Anybody recall how he got back? Or was it not explained?
Comment by DesertRat — May 20, 2008 @ 11:50 am
I am 90% sure that he did not leave on that boat so you might need to check that, although I could be wrong but I’m pretty sure he stayed with the islanders
Comment by Ian Robinson — May 20, 2008 @ 1:10 pm
stand by for nettquette violation: landryb, and anyone else that still thinks this-
BEN DOES NOT CONTROL THE “SMOKE MONSTER”!!!!!!! DOES NOT DOES NOT DOES NOT!!!!
Comment by dolce — May 20, 2008 @ 2:51 pm
Desertrat & Ian
Vincent was definitly on the boat with Michael and Walt. I also wondered how/why he was able to return. And why does he only show up every now and again. For instance, where is Vincent as we enter into the finale?
Comment by Annu — May 20, 2008 @ 5:26 pm
Ok….Vincent did NOT leave on the boat. That being said…My theory is that Vincent finally makes it off the island in season 6. Kinda like a Milo and Otis meets Lost. This will all be explained in season 6 episode 12. It is called Too Wong Foo. Vincent makes it to Korea where Mr. Paik now owns a curbside restaraunt since Sun put him out of business. Vincent winds up as a #3 special and is eaten by Hurley who is visiting Sun. LOL
Comment by CMulk — May 20, 2008 @ 7:14 pm
Vincent swam out, but once he noticed that the boat was too far out, he turned back. It was a depressing moment in an incredible finale.
Comment by LeeP — May 20, 2008 @ 11:26 pm
LeeP: Vincent swimming out to the raft (then turning back) was in the Season 1 finale.
Ian/Annu/CMulk:
My confusion over Vincent being on the boat at the end of the Season 2 finale seems to have been from viewing it on the DVD, and it might have been shown on a “deleted scenes” clip.
Lostpedia explains:
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Scenes in the Season 2 DVD extras showed Vincent in the Pala Ferry boat with Walt and Michael. Although he was never seen to be with them at the end of “Live Together, Die Alone”, this led many to believe Vincent had left the Island with them. This was later disproved in “Tricia Tanaka Is Dead”.
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Lostpedia confirms that Vincent was present off-island in the bird slamming into a glass door incident (long before the O-815 crash).
I don’t think there’s any doubt that Vincent is “different” from the yellow lab that lives down the street in my neighborhood. Just how different is a secret that the show will hopefully reveal “in the fullness of time.”
Comment by DesertRat — May 21, 2008 @ 12:40 am
Vincent stayed with Shannon when they left. Remember, Walt told Shannon to have him.
Comment by Dan — May 21, 2008 @ 1:44 am
OK EVERYONE…… First of all there is a difference between the raft launching(S1 Finale) and Michael and Walt leaving on the motor boat(S2 Finale), so stop mixing up those two events. Second, Vincent DID NOT LEAVE with Michael and Walt on the motor boat in the season 2 Finale, why, ah maybe because only Michael and Walt were on the boat when they left…Dont you remember that scene where Michael and Jack shared that betrayed look, Vincent was clearly not there!!! I believe that Ian is exactly right about Vincent, this dog has been a mystery since the very beginning of the pilot episode.
Comment by Aaron — May 21, 2008 @ 7:44 am
Sometimes a dog is just a dog.
Comment by blutoschmoooto — May 21, 2008 @ 8:17 am
Vincent… the key to it all. that’s awesome.
Since there are many religious aspects to this show and since fate/faith/karma and all that jazz play a significant role in the series…
I’m naming the final episode of season 6… the big reveal… where it all will make sense to us crazy fans.
name of the episode… none other than…. (drumroll)……
DOGMA…. lol
Comment by dwill3000 — May 21, 2008 @ 10:33 am
I think Vincent has something to do with Jacob. The picture of the dog in Jacob’s cabin was telling.
Comment by tsmilo — May 21, 2008 @ 11:37 am
Vincent (prior to the crash) was just a dog. However I agree that the Vincent we see on the show is special. In my opinion he did die in the crash. Whether or not the island brought him back to life, or he’s a ghost, or he’s a form of the smoke monster really isn’t all that important to me. I’m convinced that whatever the case is, the island is using Vincent like it has used Kate’s horse, Jack’s dad, Dave, Echo’s brother, and so on.
The writers are very intentional about things. All the points brought up about Vincent by other posters have been great. I started thinking about Vincent as being important after I watched the pilot again the other day. He shows up a few times and it’s always creepy. When Kate, Charlie and Jack are going to look for the cockpit, there’s a shot of Vincent watching from the bushes in the distance, completely silent. Also, for a labrador retriever, it sure takes him a long time to find Walt and the beach.
He’s not the key to the show, but he’s part of a bigger clue I suspect.
Comment by doug — May 21, 2008 @ 1:57 pm
look at season one when kate jack and charlie make there way to get the tranciever
from the cockpit. vincent is sitting watching them from the bushes with black eyes. i was watching it acouple of days ago and got the idea that vincent is the black smoke. freaky that this came up
Comment by willy — May 22, 2008 @ 2:29 am
Vincent is the final Cylon.
Comment by Aklias — May 22, 2008 @ 5:29 am
Your theory reminded me of this: in the pilot episode, when they first hear smokey (?) rumbling in the jungle, Walt exclaims, “Is that Vincent?!” and Michael says, “That’s not Vincent.” Maybe this hinted at more than we picked up on back then…
Comment by libby — May 22, 2008 @ 9:25 am
Another support of this.
http://www.filmfodder.com/tv/lost/archives/004546.shtml
Comment by ApolloBarEater — May 22, 2008 @ 4:05 pm
Vincent is not the smoke monster. Vincent is a dog.
What you don’t see is Vincent curled up by the fire with the other survivors–something a smoke monster would likely not do.
You’re really reaching pretty far with this one. Vincent is a dog, occasionally used as a plot device.
Now quit wasting everyone’s time.
Comment by slow17motion — May 22, 2008 @ 4:25 pm
Slow…we don’t need your attitude here,this is a site to discuss Lost.That’s what the posters are doing,so…if ya don’t like it…shove off…
Comment by Lionel Hutz — May 25, 2008 @ 6:31 pm