Lost Producers React to Spoiler-Gate ‘07
Damon and Carlton have finally opened up a little about their feelings over Spoiler Gate ‘07. I would characterize their statements as ‘tempered’ towards a minimal display of disappointment; nowhere near approaching the explosion of profanity that probably took place when they first got the word.
The downside, and part of what I was cautioning about, is that Disney security is trying to form a chain of custody to try to figure out where the finale got leaked. Sure, this is probably more a study in internal process improvement, but it is also times like this where ‘how do we combat this next year’ focus groups are held and over zealous security and legal folks start flying the ‘DMCA’ flag.
ABC has been incredibly tolerant of the rampant copyright violations that we LOST fan sites commit on an average day, and why shouldn’t they be? I mean, it is free promotion, right? But the fact is, at any given day ABC would have to do little more than write a letter to our hosting companies and registrars and we’d be forced to remove any photos, sound clips, video files, etc, that are protected by the copyright holders.
Yeah, I was sick and tired of all the spoilers, and at some points I refused to even watch promos. I prefer to just be surprised when I see it live.
Comment by mike — May 31, 2007 @ 11:17 am
This doesn’t have anything to do with this article, it has to do with the question about Christian Sheppard. Did it ever pass through anyone’s mind that perhaps Jack is lying about his father’s death? The body was lost in the crash, he said to the pharmacist that he’s “on vacation” or something…any thoughts?
Comment by Shawn — May 31, 2007 @ 11:28 am
Disney is going to find themselves on the wrong end of a bitter PR campaign if this article holds any weight.
IANAL, but attacking spoiler sites for unrelated DMCA violations legally pretty shady - and also doesn’t achieve the desired affect. This post could have very well had a spoiler in it - there’s no copyrighted material in this post (the banner, I think, falls under fair use) and Disney couldn’t legally get the page pulled down.
Comment by icyone — May 31, 2007 @ 11:31 am
Can’t seem to type worth **** today:
“…violations IS legally…”
“…desired effect…”
Comment by icyone — May 31, 2007 @ 11:33 am
I remember when Fox made the fans take down anything related to the XFiles. I dont remember if it had anything to do with spoilers though.
There are some bands that wont let you have their content posted.
ABC has been lax in this area, hopefully it wont change because of someone who posted details regarding the finale.
Comment by Sheila — May 31, 2007 @ 11:41 am
I don’t blame someone for publishing it once they have it, and i think it s a good idea for the producers to even leak a bit of information hemselves to certain people who then go ahead and reveal it, as i’m sure they do but you would think the one ep they would really wonna keep underwraps and you’d hope the people in the know would wonna to is the season finale, i can understand why they felt let down, you shouldn’t have read the spoilers, it was pretty good compared to when you spoil it
Comment by nickk — May 31, 2007 @ 11:53 am
Thanks a lot LOSTFAN108! Now you’re ruined the spoilers for next season, and potentially damages sits like this one.
Great work…
Comment by tom — May 31, 2007 @ 11:56 am
If ABC were to try to take down fan sites, it would hurt the publicity of Lost very much.
Comment by mike — May 31, 2007 @ 12:03 pm
I am the only one saying DMCA at this point, however I don’t think that Disney exercising their DMCA rights against sites that damaging their properties would be shady in the least.
Comment by DocArzt — May 31, 2007 @ 12:19 pm
DocArtz, you are such a tool and a crybaby.
You got scooped big time, plain and simple and now you and your sight which contained spoilers is anti-spoiler.
= “If I can’t win, I’m taking my ball and going home.”
Comment by Jim — May 31, 2007 @ 12:31 pm
No Jim, I’m one of the good guys. There was nothing preventing me from posting the spoilers. I was there the moment the synopsis hit. In the interim, my good friend Dark actually shared what was going to be posted. By the way, did you know that “Lost Spoilers” is nowhere near the top search terms in the Lost web game? Come back when you know what your talking about.
Comment by DocArzt — May 31, 2007 @ 12:35 pm
I’d like to vouch for Doc here. He’s not and has never been anti-spoiler. He’s anti-ruining the frigging show. There’s a subtle difference and if you don’t see it none of us can explain it to ya.
Comment by TrillianM — May 31, 2007 @ 12:39 pm
Frankly, Jim, it ain’t about getting scooped. It is about people that loathe themselves so much that they want to bring others down into the depths of their despair. It is about those “tools” that came here posting spoilers in comments to specifically take away the joy of the surprise.
This site has always been very balanced. Yes, this site contains spoilers, but each of those nuggets of gold are more teasers than spoilers. Besides, why would Doc ruin his reputation with certain sources by violating their confidence with things that are off-the-record?
We gather here because we enjoy the community and the discussion. If the readers of this site really wanted to get spoiled, there are plenty of places to go. But we genuinely enjoy the telling of this story.
If you hate this site and its content, then why waste your time here?
Comment by TabulaRasa — May 31, 2007 @ 12:51 pm
Thanks TrillianM, Tab. Yes folks, this site is about the conversation and reveling in the weirdness of the show. How much will it suck if things tighten up so much that we have less to work with next season? Who will we have to blame? Me for not posting the ‘ruiner’ when I had the chance?
Comment by DocArzt — May 31, 2007 @ 12:54 pm
That’s just it, Doc - Disney can’t pick and choose why they want to serve you with a DMCA. They are required to aggressively defend their intellectual property. Let’s say, for arguments sake, that Disney finds the image of the journal to be in violation. They serve you with a notice (not a takedown, but a notice, as is required by law). What about lostpedia? Or DarkUFO? Or any number of sites that are hosting the same image?
And what would be the difference? Disney doesn’t like you, that’s what. And most importantly, it wouldn’t take down the site (you remove the image, still in business) and you could still post spoilers.
Man, you could run nothing but a website that served plain text spoilers, and there’s not a damn thing Disney could do about it.
Comment by icyone — May 31, 2007 @ 12:56 pm
Well, as expected the Doc called it. Hopefully all the people who protested when the Doc came out against Spoilergate will read this and see that they were wrong. There’s a difference between spoilers and completely exposing somebody’s work. This definitely crossed the line and for all of us spoiler-free people, it’s almost embarrasing how many members of the Lost community read those spoilers. Plus, now it looks like we’re going to be babied by Darlton and ABC. Yep, looks like we’ve pretty much lost their trust.
What I just can’t understand is why somebody would want to read a little skimpy typed-up paragraph giving away all the goodies of the finale, instead of just watching it and enjoy the twists as they come. Are some Lost fans really that impatient?
Comment by BlackSmoke — May 31, 2007 @ 1:12 pm
Icy, do you own intellectual property? I understand your disagreement, but it is wrong. They absolutely could focus on singular instances. It’s not criminal proceedings. In that case, yes, they would have no choice but to go after the community. But if they wanted to send a stern message to single sites, they could. Would they? Probably not. The point is, it is a tool they have their disposal. It’s nothing I think anybody involved with the show would do. Frankly I was sweating the returns on May 23rd, because if the finale had tanked there would be a stronger backlash for sure.
But mentioning that tool was not intended to start a conversation based on whether or not they will use it. The point is, the event sent shock waves over there. Damon and Carlton are being very reserved with their reaction, as noted, but Disney is turning the place upside down.
Comment by DocArzt — May 31, 2007 @ 1:25 pm
I dont understand why anyone would want to read spoilers. BlackSmoke, I could’nt have said it better myself…. Why would somebody want to read a little skimpy typed-up paragraph, when you could watch a great show?!?!?!
I remember someone ruined the twist when Naomi told Hurley that everyone on board 815 was dead. I was not at all happy about that. It would have been so much better to watch it as it happened on the show.
I didn’t even go one any lost fan sites the entire week leading up to the finale because I didn’t want it to be ruined. And I am glad I did. I wouldn’t care if not one more spoiler was leaked. In fact I would be thrilled. It’s a great show! Watch it and enjoy!
Comment by BucK — May 31, 2007 @ 1:52 pm
Jim,
I agree w/ Trillian. If you can’t see the difference between the spoilers that were posted prior to “spoilergate” and the “spoilergate” spoilers you clearly shouldn’t be saying anything.
To post something such as an upcoming cast member, or the upcoming flashback schedule is one thing. But to post what in turn is the final scene of the show that reveals something so big as “they get rescued” is something much bigger and more obtrusive to the whole viewing process. Again, if you can’t tell the difference, you need help.
Doc isn’t about crying “foul” just to protect his interests, it’s about trying to protect the interests of the show, and what the writers work so hard to protect.
Comment by Dr. Nope — May 31, 2007 @ 2:12 pm
I think Disney will crack down on the perpetrator, not the sites. The sites do everything to promote the show. For every little spoiler, there are 3 times as many other stories that feed the fan interest.
The saddest part is that any information coming from anywhere will most likely be clamped down on and shut off from the regular folks, leaving us with that Kristin nimrod and Ausiello and his frak attacks…
Personally, I can read the spoilers and not give two hoots..It helps me pay closer attention to what I’m seeing. Nothing will ever replace the visual beauty of this show…
Comment by El Prez — May 31, 2007 @ 2:47 pm
gusteaux - “With enough time and money, you can find anyone.” Will Lostfan108 yet be exposed? If Disney is serious enough about it, I’d bet they will be. The problem, as Carlton expressed, is that if LF108 is not an employee, it makes little difference, especially if they snatched it off the counter like Cuse said.
Personally, this is such a huge infraction in that industry, I’d be offering up the reward money if I were Disney. Nothing brings the truth out quicker than money. Offer $20k for the identity of LF108 and his/her kids or parents will rat him out. The question is, then what do you do? You walk it up the line of course, somebody has to pay the price.
I think what amazes me the most is how little the spoiler fans seem to understand how major an incident this was for our beloved creators. This had to be emotionally awful for them, and from a business sense it was a total low point for the industry. I would almost put this in the same category as the workprint of Revenge of the Sith turning up on torrents the night before it was theatrically released. Not in magnitude, but in audacity.
Comment by DocArzt — May 31, 2007 @ 2:49 pm
Doc:
I have always believed that the leak came from an employee or a post production subcontractor’s employee. If the former, fire the bastard. If the latter, fire the subcontractor. And you’re right, “With enough money and enough DETERMINATION,” they will find the culprit.
Comment by gusteaux — May 31, 2007 @ 3:16 pm
gusteaux - I reserve the right to paraphrase! (just kidding) It should be very interesting to see how things turn out. There are obviously people who could give this guy up, it then becomes a matter of journalistic integrity though. I’m guessing anybody who published the info first hand isn’t going to be of assistance in serving him up.
Comment by DocArzt — May 31, 2007 @ 3:29 pm
As I’ve mentioned elsewhere already, I don’t think the spoilers were that big a deal - maybe because I pretty much predicted the switch from flashbacks to flashforwards in my review of the Greatest Hits episode, the week before … Flashfowards…
In fact, from my point of view, the worst thing about the spoilers (which I never ever read) is that they invalidate the process of geniune prediction, by depriving accurate predictions of their clout.
But, in the general scheme of things, I think spoilers are inevitable, and come with all highly charged territory in the entertainment world.
Comment by Paul Levinson — May 31, 2007 @ 3:46 pm
From a personal perspective Paul, you hit the nail on the head. My biggest problem with the spoilers personally was that it made it difficult for me to do my usual course of speculation. Not to mention the fact that any attempt to ignore the existence of the spoilers and proceed with ‘business as usual’ was constantly disrupted by somebody relying on info from the spoilers to disprove assumptions.
For instance, my time line thread that I manufactured from the promos. It actually turned out to be dreadfully wrong in a few places, but throughout the discourse folks who read the spoilers were using the info to prove or disprove certain points. Worse yet, they questioned why do it if you already know from the spoilers.
Essentially people were engaging in post-finale conversation weeks ahead with just enough information to come across as inept.
Comment by DocArzt — May 31, 2007 @ 4:03 pm
Touche’, Doc!
You don’t have to REserve the right because you DEserve the right!
Comment by gusteaux — May 31, 2007 @ 6:45 pm
No one’s going after anyone….there’s nothing to be gained, in litigation or in terms of stopping leaks..The bottom line is that it didn’t hurt the ratings…Until it affects the bottom line, I doubt anything will be done…As far a Darlton is concerned, and having their feelings hurt, things like this are bound to happen..You can’t tease things in your podcasts or to Kristen and not expect someone to expose you when they get a chance..It’s like sticking your tongue out to a bully and not expecting to get slapped for your audacity…
I don’t feel sorry for them in the least..They create a PRODUCT that is consumed by the masses…The thing about the product is that it needs to be consumed WHOLLY, not in parts…If you tell me you’re serving chicken, I’ll expect chicken…what I won’t expect is BBQ chicken with all the fixin’s….and that’s what happened with the finale…we were told how it would be but we didn’t know all the details….it was still delicious….
Comment by El Prez — May 31, 2007 @ 8:31 pm
Way to bring the rationale Prez.
I think, as I said, the whole investigation is more to make sure none of their internal people were involved. The problem is, one of them most certainly was, even if it wasn’t necessarily intentional. I’m sure the timing will mean everything. All they have to do is think in terms of what departments would have had it around the time AintItCoolNews first published their vague version. I doubt Disney is investigating it on a lark.
Comment by DocArzt — May 31, 2007 @ 9:26 pm
When Damon and Carlton said they were going into “radio silence” next season, do you think they also meant no podcasts? I hope not. I look forward to them almost as much as I look forward to the show.
Comment by Uncle Mike — June 1, 2007 @ 8:19 am
UncleMike - They mean in the interim. They are not going to answer the question of what the “rattlesnake” meant for the future of the show, although AintItCoolNews, who is responsible for Spoilergate to begin with, says that they confirmed the formula. We’ll see though.
Comment by DocArzt — June 1, 2007 @ 10:35 am
Doc,
Why is this scumbag still allowed to post here?
Comment by gusteaux — June 1, 2007 @ 2:26 pm
I have been visiting this site from the very beginning. I very rarely post. When I do, I tend to use a new moniker each time. Anyway, to my point:
I come to this site because of the community, the way spoilers are treated as teasers, and I want to THANK Doc for not blasting the LF108 spoiler all over the site. I managed to avoid being spoiled (I knew of LF108 and his spoilers, having picked up on things, and was able to avoid them), and was lucky enough to watch the finale not knowing a single thing about what was going to happen. I prefer it that way.
I agree with everything TabulaRasa said above May31 12:51.
Doc please keep things as they are. Thanks again.
M
Comment by Balcony — June 1, 2007 @ 3:32 pm
Balcony, thank you. There is something interesting about the nature of the internet. People show their true nature, what is really locked in their hearts, on the internet.
Especially on sites like this where there is open, engaging, and for the most part anonymous conversation. We have the freedom to change our avatar, we have the freedom to express without fear of reprisal.
Our character is refined when we think we are not being watched. So, our posts on this site really does show who we are deep down.
Comment by TabulaRasa — June 1, 2007 @ 7:33 pm
Followup to previous post…
exhibit A, Gusteaux, his posts have been inquisitive, insightful, and funny. That says great deal about who he is.
exhibit B, Funtime, behavior that borders on harrassment. Each statement of hate is a mirror to himself.
Comment by TabulaRasa — June 2, 2007 @ 5:20 am
I was gonna let funtime slide, but i gotta throw this out there. For a person with such an exciting life, as you claim, and a person in college, why are you posting on a Friday night at midnight??
Shouldn’t you be out with some of your made-up friends, or maybe working on that made-up study you claimed to be working on last week.
As far as a response, don’t bother, because everything you’ve said so far has been a lie, so there is nothing you can really say to make anybody actually believe you.
Comment by Dr. Nope — June 2, 2007 @ 11:00 am
Eh, the thing of it is, without his spoilers he’s just a sad troll making weak attacks on people’s weight and masturbation rituals. He’s really kind of pathetic in this weakened state. Notice how specific he was about where his ’study’ is going to be appearing. In the Sunday post. You’ll be able to provide a link to that, right FunTime?
Comment by DocArzt — June 2, 2007 @ 8:24 pm
I feel for the producers and I think that the release of total episode spoilers (especially season finales) is wrong.
You can hide them behind warnings and links to separate pages, but you must admit that people will read them and then start discussing them in the comment sections of different websites as if they are common knowledge. I think this is the issue here. You must know that people will do this. If you pretend not to acknowledge that this is how people behave, you’re choosing to bury your head in the sand. It doesn’t absolve you of responsibility.
It’s not that people who consciously clicked on total episode spoiler links were themselves spoiled. It’s that some of these people took these spoilers and revealed them where they didn’t belong.
I am no fan of Lostfan108, but I’m even less a fan of those who chose to propogate his/her spoilers.
Comment by Lance — June 2, 2007 @ 9:28 pm
I didn’t see Funtime’s claim that this was going to be writing this for the Sunday post. When he first brought it up he said he was a psychology major and was doing this all for his thesis. He really ruined his credibilty when as a self-proclaimed psych. major he starts name-calling and stereotyping as blatantly as he does.
Doc,
can you at least make me feel a little better by telling me that you did file complaints to his ISP’s last week like you said. To know that nothing is being done and he is getting away with all this would kill me.
Comment by Dr. Nope — June 3, 2007 @ 11:46 am
Nope, all he is doing is removing my posts. What can complaints do when I am only telling you people the truth about your sad sad lives? This is the internet. This is what you sick sad people are. This is why I came to this country in the first place, god bless America!
P.S. Sorry you didn’t catch my story. The San Marcos Post has a website but does not publish online without and archive subscription. My school does publish thesis’ in a acompendium one year later so that one is still a way off. Just to let you know the fact that you guys are still talking about the spoilers and me is just feeding this thing. My professor is eating up every funny insult you write, I must thank you.
Comment by FunTime — June 3, 2007 @ 1:14 pm
Then you’ll be good enough to scan it for us and post it on image shack? We’ll be waiting for your url.
FunTime, do you really think telling random people they are fat or mastrubate in their basement is worthy of academic accolades? It wouldn’t even be a study in psychology, sociology maybe, but psychology would be more like us examining why you feel remarks on weight and sexual gratification are so damaging.
So your not out of the woods, post the article. Let’s see it.
Comment by DocArzt — June 3, 2007 @ 1:55 pm
San Marcos Post, eh? Which edition? I have a friend there who can pick up a copy, if you’re telling the truth….
Comment by KrissyLove — June 4, 2007 @ 3:20 pm
Doubtful, because I can’t even find the paper. Can you verify it even exists Krissy? Poor FunTime. Again, it just isn’t any fun anymore now that he doesn’t have any ‘real’ ammunition. Sadly, our FunTime is a poster child for trepanation gone bad.
Comment by DocArzt — June 4, 2007 @ 4:07 pm
I have family that live in that area. There is only the San Marcos Daily Record and the University Newspaper. I will be down there later this week doing some work and taking the kids to Sea World. If such a publication exists, I am sure to run across it.
Comment by TabulaRasa — June 4, 2007 @ 6:38 pm
Of course, we should all reiterate that we know this ‘interview’ does not exist. Who in the really real worl would even care about it?
Comment by DocArzt — June 5, 2007 @ 4:04 am
Below you will find an e mail address to the psychology department at The U of Texas. Please feel free to send them your thoughts not only on their students conduct, but also their encouragment of such a paper to be written.
I get the feeling, if he acutally is writing this article he is only showing our reactions and not including his comments that set-off our reactions.
So please, contact his department and let them know just how immature, unreasonable, offensive, rude…(fill in your own description) they are dealing with. Because undoubtedly if they knew the actions that one of their students was taking to write a thesis, they would have to take some sort of action.
undergrad@psy.utexas.edu
Comment by Fun Times Over — June 5, 2007 @ 12:20 pm
Personally I would not bother. FunTime wants you to believe this is what he is doing, in reality there is no way in hell a topic so banal would make thesis material. Unless your one of my myspace buds, you probably don’t know that I pursued a PHD in psychology. I wound up breaking it into two Bachelors, but I was deep enough into the science to know that a behavioral study of people on message boards would get laughed out of the auditorium.
Personally, I was moving towards a thesis detailing a theory I had on polymorphic integration of behavioral modification as a validation of Psychology’s importance in the scientific process, particularly towards validating Holonic brain models. And THAT faced some serious push back from my mentor.
In general, the paper is going to have to show an understanding of finite concepts in practical application. Something tells me calling people “fatties” and going on about masturbation in between posting spoilers where they don’t belong wouldn’t harbor much in the way of useful application in a grad school.
Comment by DocArzt — June 5, 2007 @ 1:23 pm