The Brig Official Description!
Here it is! The description for The Brig!
Locke breaks away from the Others to try to persuade Sawyer to help get rid of a common nemesis; a new island inhabitant discloses shocking information about the survivors’ flight.
Source: Wchs
It’s interesting that Locke wants Sawyer involved in dealing with…well, Sawyer. That should be an interesting combination. And I wonder what else we can find out about the flight that would solve any mysteries? We know why it went down…maybe why it lost communications? Or maybe it was intended to go off course?
Comment by ParkwaySouth — April 14, 2007 @ 8:35 am
This is the first time I’ve ever speculated in a post. But what the heck? If you think I’m wrong, flame me. In watching the scenes of 815’s mid-air breakup on the monitors in the flame in slow motion, I noticed something that has been in front of our eyes since the Pilot. In fact, it’s a scene we’ve seen repeatedly over the three seasons. The sight of a plume of black smoke in conjunction with a crashing airplane seems natural. But if you look closely, while the plane is moving forward, the black smoke plume is too. This is unnatural. The smoke should be moving in the opposite direction of the plane. Perhaps Des didn’t cause 815 to crash after all?
Comment by gusteaux — April 14, 2007 @ 9:08 am
maybe the “shocking information” is that the flight landed after all…which supports the theory of multiple dimensions and/or time lines.
Comment by babelfish — April 14, 2007 @ 9:21 am
the common enemy that Locke and James (Sawyer) have in common is Lockes father aka the original Sawyer
Comment by Catch21 — April 14, 2007 @ 9:42 am
It says common nemesis not enemy. There is a subtle difference. I think the nemesis to which they refer could be Jack.
Comment by James — April 14, 2007 @ 9:59 am
Websters defintion:
Nemesis: a formidable and usually victorious rival or opponent
I think that fits the ‘real’ sawyer quite well.
Comment by Tom — April 14, 2007 @ 1:05 pm
If you watch the original pilot episode of the crash in slow motion you will see the smoke follow it down and then shoot quickly back up into the air.It looks anything but natural.
Comment by H20 — April 14, 2007 @ 1:26 pm
there seems to be a lot of nemesises (nemesi?) in the remaining episodes. first the unlikely nemesis and now a common nemesis? for crying out loud…
Comment by goldenmalicious — April 14, 2007 @ 1:38 pm
I believe the others are DHARMA or at least unnatural to the island. If what you guys speculate (Smokey takes down the plane), then I believe he wants these people to get rid of the others. Smokey would either have something to do with a race of island natives or in fact be the island (a manifestation of souls/energy). We’ve heard the whispers when Smokey’s around. Maybe these souls (who have manifested into Smokey) are trapped by the experimentation and are trying to fight the others…
Comment by cap10tripps — April 14, 2007 @ 1:40 pm
If Smokey wants the others gone and needs the 815ers help then why would Mr. Ecko have died?
Comment by Nathan — April 14, 2007 @ 2:10 pm
after reading this theory that smokey took down the plane i went back and watched the mid-air breakup at least a dozen times, and i do not see a single thing that looks even remotely like smokey. what exactly are you guys looking at? and as for the idea that smokey wants to survivors to destroy the others, that wouldn’t make any sense seeing as how he keeps killing the survivors. just sayn.
Comment by emery — April 14, 2007 @ 2:10 pm
can someone get a screen shot of this smoke thats around the plane? i’m too lazy to do it myself. thats why i come to these sites.
Comment by goldenmalicious — April 14, 2007 @ 2:36 pm
The producers have already said a few times that the smoke in the pilot episode that looks like it could be the smoke monster is a glitch in the F/X and that the monster wasn’t seen until “Exodus”
Comment by Jeff — April 14, 2007 @ 3:41 pm
Locke breaks away from the others? Really, he escapes? Maybe he realizes that the others do not have the answers he is looking for.
To get rid of - as in to murder. So if Locke is acting in the will of the island, then the island wants Cooper dead?
The “purge” that Mikhail may be happening right now, by removing all of the Dharma stations and all of those that are trying to use the island for their own purpose. It is the others against the island. Since John is a “Prophet” of the island, maybe he realizes that they are the true danger.
Comment by TabulaRasa — April 14, 2007 @ 5:45 pm
How is it that smokey could reach 10,000 feet into the sky and pluck a 747 from its flight, and yet it couldn’t reach over a 20 foot sonic fence?
Comment by tigardspaz — April 14, 2007 @ 5:49 pm
I agree with you about the fence it does seem inconsistent. But if you go to the point in the pilot episode when Locke is helping Artz to get to a safer place he looks and sees the guy who authored the “Bad Twin” novel and yells to him to get out of the way. Right after he is sucked in the next frame is of a girl who looks a lot like Kate running across the screen. In the sky behind her is the black smoke. Over several frames it descends and strikes the engine and then goes straight back up into the air. After that the engine explodes. I think if I was one of the producers I would be interested in people not noticing this until it plays out in the story. I can hear the podcast now “Oh you guys meant that SMOKE
Comment by H20 — April 14, 2007 @ 8:19 pm
Sorry, H20, the dark shape prior to the engine explosion has already been dismissed by the producers as an unintentional artifact of the effects process. See http://lostpedia.com/wiki/Turbine_explosion_%28debunked_theory%29
Comment by Richard Lennox — April 14, 2007 @ 8:24 pm
They also said this;
Lindelof’s statement that “There isn’t any time travel,” in SCI FI Wire. In Flashes Before Your Eyes some fans argue that Desmond travels through time. However, it remains unclear whether the time travel theory is true, or if the producers have been truthful, and Desmond had a very vivid flashback.
Maybe they are not completely truthful like Ben.
Comment by H20 — April 14, 2007 @ 8:35 pm
You heard it first. The big surprise death is… John Locke. After Locke disposes of his father. Sawyer shoots Locke because Cooper is Sawyer’s real father. Then Sawyer dies. Watch, this is how it will play out.
Comment by homermoose — April 14, 2007 @ 8:38 pm
I know people have their doubts about Smokey having something to do with the crash of 815 but if you go back and watch the very first episode in certain scences you can see something flying around. Some say its just a bird but it’s not a bird it moves to fast and flies through one of the engines before it explodes.
Comment by Reggie — April 14, 2007 @ 8:52 pm
They also said this;
Lindelof’s statement that “There isn’t any time travel,” in SCI FI Wire. In Flashes Before Your Eyes some fans argue that Desmond travels through time.
So far, we’ve seen no evidence that Desmond actually *did* travel through time. Two possibilities that allow for what we were shown in “Flashes Before Your Eyes” and don’t rely on time travel are as follows:
1) Desmond revisited previous events in his own mind. The Ms. Hawking was in fact his own subconscious and nothing more.
2) Desmond crossed into a different dimension in which events very similar but slightly different to his own experiences occurred. Interference by Ms. Hawking was to ensure that he, being the Desmond from a different dimension, didn’t perform any actions based on his experiences in his own dimension and disrupt the timeline of another.
Of course, H20, I’m expecting troublesome stuffs at the end of the next episode, just as you are. You’re probably right: we should expect the producers to pull some semantic/technicality-laden tricks. Hell, if I were Lindelof or Cuse, I’d have milked that effects artifact for all it’s worth…what a nice coincidental way to paint oneself out of a corner!
Comment by Richard Lennox — April 14, 2007 @ 10:55 pm
Er, make that “rely explicitly on time travel”. Crossing between parallel realities is different, or so TV, movies, and comic books have led me to believe.
Comment by Richard Lennox — April 14, 2007 @ 10:56 pm
“How is it that smokey could reach 10,000 feet into the sky and pluck a 747 from its flight, and yet it couldn’t reach over a 20 foot sonic fence?”
Posted by: tigardspaz | April 14, 2007 5:49 PM
hahahahahaha thats so true
Comment by mz deelo — April 15, 2007 @ 1:13 am
How is it that smokey could reach 10,000 feet into the sky and pluck a 747 from its flight, and yet it couldn’t reach over a 20 foot sonic fence?
One possibility to consider is that the sound waves aren’t just broadcast laterally on an X axis, but rather radially from each of the large circular discs/dishes on each pylon. The smoke monster would need to backtrack a fair distance and climb above the maximum height of the signal prior to encountering the fence. Considering we don’t know what smokey is actually made of, we don’t know how the sound waves interact with it or vice-versa. Vary the signal enough to where it occasionally hits several hundred feet above the top of each pylon and you’ve got a good (if not entirely reliable) method of keeping the thing at bay.
Just a thought, though. Expect a significantly lamer and less-involved explanation from the producers, if any.
Comment by Richard Lennox — April 15, 2007 @ 2:16 am
First I need to apologize, this is not relevant to this thread however I didnt know where else to post it and I figured since this is pretty recent someone who could help me we would read this here.
Anyway, I was watching season 2 last night and during the 23rd psalm I noticed that while smokey is looking at echo you can see flshes of echo’s past. First a picture of te church, than a woman from the villiage, his brother….and the last image is of the crucifixion. My question is has this been discussed previously or have I found something new?
Comment by stoletim108 — April 15, 2007 @ 7:38 am
stoletim108
I think this has been seen before cuz i can remember seeying pics of it. Just to let ya know
Comment by rob — April 15, 2007 @ 8:00 am
homermoose there is no way they would kill John Locke off he is just to popular
Comment by steveuk2007 — April 15, 2007 @ 8:52 am
smokey can’t go over the fence because even though he flies around in the air, hes locked to the position below him on the ground. he is the guardian of the underworld after all. assuming that was not him in the pilot, we have never seen him higher than about 30 feet up, and when he is that high, his base expands and tapers off towards the top.
Comment by goldenmalicious — April 15, 2007 @ 9:13 am
The unfinished SOS that Bernard made that is in the preview is very important I believe because it is a picture of something else. To me it looks like something cosmic or to do with stars. I think it is a clue to an mystery in Lost and it indicates that Rose and Bernard are very important characters in the over all story. I read on another post something interesting about Rose representing the color red and Rose is Black and Bernard white. This encompasses the three color themes found in Lost. Again foreshadowing something important about their Characters. In just rewatching the pilot I notice that Rose said that the sound of Smokey sounded very familiar to her.
Comment by H20 — April 15, 2007 @ 11:22 am
If you watch the scenes from inside the plane when it splits apart, it sounds like Smokey. This would seem to collaborate with Smokey taking the plane down (Rose recalls the sound). If any of this is true, then possible explanations could be…
1. the fences work differently than we assume
2. Smokey is some sort of psychic manifestation
3. There is more than one Smokey
By the way, the scene where we see the plane split from an outside point of view does not occur until after “Exodus.” Perhaps the smoke in the pilot is a glitch, but the smoke we see around 815 while it’s in the air is not…
Comment by cap10tripps — April 15, 2007 @ 2:57 pm
A few days after “Not In Portland” aired, I tired to start several conversations about the following. I will bring it up again now because it seems to be relevant to Smokie’s range. In the scene where Juliet’s ex-husband was hit by the bus, Smokie was in front of the bus. Slo-mo the scene, from the time her ex steps into the street and you will clearly see a wall of black smoke in front of the bus. All the screen caps I saw posted on various sites were a couple of frames later, trying to see the Apollo Bar signage on the side of the bus. This is before that. I have no doubt whatsoever that Smokie was there…off the island! I do not have the ability to do screen captures, but I would really apprecite it if someone who can would capture the shot and post it. This to me is perhaps the most important clue we have gotten to this point and nobody seems to want to acknowledge or discuss it.
Comment by gusteaux — April 15, 2007 @ 3:14 pm
their common nemesis of sorts IS JACK.
Comment by me — April 15, 2007 @ 3:23 pm
Doc Arzt:
Your efforts in spotting and posting the screen caps showing Patchy’s arm cuff and Sun closing the vault with Juliet were heroic. Please go back to “Not In Portland” and capture the shot of Smokey preceeding the bus that hits Juliet’s ex. It is between where he steps into the street and the POV cut to the Apollo Bar sign on the side of the bus. I really think this is HUGE. I promise it’s there, I wouldn’t send you on a wild goose chase brotha.
Comment by gusteaux — April 15, 2007 @ 4:07 pm
I second you, Gusteax. I remember you bringing this up, and being that my computer is six years old (and no dvr) I have trouble watching past episodes. I believe the big dudes hinted at the fact that even before “Not in Portland” we’ve seen Smokey off the island. I’m thinking the Smokey fence probably reaches to the top of the snow globe (or at least very high and wide), so Smokey can’t just jump over or around it. Also, Smokey cannot squeeze through the area between the cylanders. However, it does not mean that he couldn’t travel up high to grab something traveling through island air space…
Comment by cap10tripps — April 15, 2007 @ 4:51 pm
A thought just occurred. If there is a Smokey patroling the island floor, perhaps there is a Smokey patroling the island ceiling…
Comment by cap10tripps — April 15, 2007 @ 4:55 pm
Here’s another thought: Maybe Des’s failure to timely enter the numbers DID in fact initiate the plane crash. Then Smokey went into action to control the crash, making sure that there were survivors by “softening” the crash. Also Smokey could have been involved in making sure that the tailsection containing A) Cindy and the children (the good ones) and B) the worst of the survivors (Eko, Ana Lucia, Libby and the guy Ana killed mistakenly thinking he was an other) who are all dead now (with the exception of Bernhard, who wasn’t supposed to be in the tailsection) were separated from the fuselage passengers who were brought to the island for a purpose.
Comment by gusteaux — April 15, 2007 @ 5:24 pm
Excellent theory, gusteaux. There’s no way Smokey could’ve done a “scan”+judgement on each one person as they fell from the sky; we’ve already seen it takes several seconds to accomplish it for one person, and with the exception of the pilot’s demise, anyone who has been killed (or at least directly attacked) by Smokey has had a close encounter with it previously. Since Smokey can move objects with mass, but seemingly not without focusing, the easiest thing to do would be to slow down the larger sections of the plane so more people could be spared for subsequent judgment.
Comment by Richard Lennox — April 15, 2007 @ 5:43 pm
This could also explain why Ben believed there was a fair chance of there being survivors, despite the plane breaking apart (without wings, there’d be less air resistance in the fall without some external force slowing it down) and falling from a substantial altitude.
Comment by Richard Lennox — April 15, 2007 @ 5:44 pm
I’ve been thinking for awhile that the plane was supposed to land on the island for DHARMA purposes. However, the island got to the plane first. Smokey is a manifestation of the island and needed some recruits to save itself. We’ve seen Smokey manifest itself into Christian in “White Rabbit.” I believe it does this to lead Jack to the water. The island wants to rid itself of these experiments and human contamination that is DHARMA, Mittelos, and/or Hanso…
Comment by cap10tripps — April 15, 2007 @ 9:21 pm
gusteaux, I went back to watch that scene and you are correct. There is something Smokey like in front of the bus. If you watch it in super slo-mo you can see something. Smokey or not, something is there. Juliet mentioned to Mr Albert that Burke wouldn’t allow her to go to Mittelos. Then she made the hit by a bus statement. Well we all know Burke was hit by a bus. We are led to believe that the hit was orchestrated somehow by Mr Albert. So how could Mr Albert get help from Smokey? We should assume Mr. Albert is an other. Juliet told Kate the others knew about the monster but didn’t know what it was(I know she could have been lying). The sonic fence was keeping Smokey away from the others.
Comment by jmaxx — April 15, 2007 @ 9:49 pm
Thank you jmaxx. I have been trying to get this discussion going since February 7. The others/mittelos are in control of Smokey. The scene at the fence was pre-planned, just like everything else Ben/Juliet have orchestrated to deceive the 815ers. Smokey had no intention of harming Juliet or Kate. It was all for show, as was Smokey’s seeming inability to go over the fence. The fence is meant to keep someone/something out, but Smokey is not that someone/something. Leading us to believe that the fence is to control Smokey’s access is yet another misdirection.
Comment by gusteaux — April 15, 2007 @ 10:11 pm
I think Juliet is lying about the others not knowing what Cerberus is. I mean the survivors were on the island how long before they had every little detail on them? Somehow I don’t think the others will adopt a ‘eh it’s just something on the island’ attitude.
Comment by Ben's Wheelchair — April 16, 2007 @ 2:21 am
I think Juliet is lying about the others not knowing what Cerberus is. I mean the survivors were on the island how long before they had every little detail on them? Somehow I don’t think the others will adopt a ‘eh it’s just something on the island’ attitude.
Comment by Ben's Wheelchair — April 16, 2007 @ 2:21 am
It would definitely be a game changer if Smokey can venture off island.
If it can appear off island, then it COULD be the nexus between Earth Variation A and Earth Variation D or E or whatever.
For example, it brings the bus that exists at that moment on Earth Variation C into Earth Variation A to run over Juliet’s ex. That’s is why you see it (if indeed it is there) just before the “Final Destination Moment.”
I have not seen nor am I convinced that Smokey can exist off Island … yet.
Comment by TabulaRasa — April 16, 2007 @ 2:07 pm
TabulaRasa:
I really hate to be a broken record. But, obviously I am convinced that Smokey can exist off island. I’ve been trying to get DocArzt to review the bus scene in “Not In Portland” to confirm it for everyone, but he seems to keep missing my posted requests. I agree that Smokey off the island is the ultimate game changer…thus far.
Comment by gusteaux — April 16, 2007 @ 2:48 pm
I totally agree and have believed for awhile that smokey is what guided the plane down gently enough to allow survivors.I believe that others control it. And if they do control it then it would not go over the fence or hurt one of them unless told to.But it could be used to make Kate depend on Juliet to be safe and trust her more. The fence may just be for the ememy fraction whoever they are to keep them away from the others.
Comment by H20 — April 16, 2007 @ 3:29 pm
Episode 19 DOES have flashbacks. They are of Locke and his time with the Others.
Comment by Norbert — April 16, 2007 @ 6:08 pm
Does anyone know anything about this;
That in the pilot episode there was supposed to be a “missed clue” and Lindelof has mentioned this before?
This is interesting in view of the earlier discussions we had about smokie.
I have recently watched the pilot episode and noticed in
the scene when Charlie & Kate go back to find Jack in the jungle they pass a fallen tree and as Charlie goes over it you can see a metal object on the tree branch. I just figured they messed up and it was a light or prop that someone left there by mistake. Not that I think this is the missed clue but has it been commented on before?
Comment by H20 — April 16, 2007 @ 7:17 pm
The show has really picked up from the 1st 6 episodes this season, all credit to CC and DL for sticking to the plan. I say Ben dies in the second to last episode. Everything points to it. A power struggle, rumors of 2 camps with Jack on one side and Sawyer on the other. Kate will be with who? The power vacuum will be left when Ben dies.
Comment by revelations, chapter 6 verse 3 — April 17, 2007 @ 5:06 am
Anyone remember the details of the blast door map? CV = Cerebus Vent…i.e the various holes in the ground which Smokey uses to emerge and into which it once tried to drag Locke. The existence of those vents leads me to believe that Smokey stays underground most of the time and travels a network of tunnels. The “vents” are the means by which it comes to the surface.
But, what does it mean? Is Cerebus an invention of Dharma? Or was Cerebus there before Dharma? The “guardian” of the island’s secrets?
Comment by Hoosierdaddy — April 17, 2007 @ 9:37 am
One more thing about Smokey and the crash of 815, there was plenty of smoke surrounding the plane. But as the plane went down, the smoke remained mixed in with the main cabin contrail. The smoke didn’t make any sudden movements, it acted as you would expect smoke from a fire to act.
Now, this doesn’t mean that Smokey didn’t have something to do with it, but there is confirmation that the plane had smoke around it as it broke apart. The views of the plane coming down from the Other’s perspective doesn’t seem to support the “Smokey in the air” theory
Comment by TabulaRasa — April 17, 2007 @ 5:25 pm
TabulaRasa:
I could easily be convinced to let go of the “Smokey in the air” theory with regard to the decent of 815. I’d actually give that theory about a 10% probability. But the “Smokey in front of the Bus” observation is not theory, it was there visually…100% sure.
Comment by gusteaux — April 17, 2007 @ 6:28 pm
I finally found some screencaps of not in portland on a couple of other sites, not sure if Doc would let me post the links, but you can google them. I had to use two different sites and I think I see what you are talking about, but i am convinced that it is just the bus coming into view. The front of the bus and the door are black. It looks like the two caps that I compared are sequential. If that is the case, what looks like smokey is the f/x blend.
In these captures, it really doesn’t look like smokey, to me. But it doesn’t settle the debate, either. It leaves room for us to continue to the imagining. Some needs to ask tptb.
Comment by TabulaRasa — April 17, 2007 @ 8:00 pm
Agreed. In fact, I submitted that very question to DocArzt when he interviewed TBTB. Unfortunately it didn’t get enough poll votes. I don’t have a DVR, so I tape LOST. When I look at the tape of that scene in slow-mo and in single frame advance it is quite obvious and doesn’t appear to be an f/x blend. I have shown this to several people who were shocked upon seeing it.
Comment by gusteaux — April 18, 2007 @ 5:22 am