I Do - The Jacob Equation
Think there wasn’t a big twist last night? We learned one very interesting thing: there may still be another “other” amongst the 815′rs! Why? Listen up:
While Pickett was leaving Ben’s surgery to go kill Sawyer he says that “Shephard” wasn’t even on “Jacob’s” list. Ethan’s real name was definitely Ethan. We saw this both in Tale of Two Cities, and Maternity Leave. However, also in Maternity leave we witnessed Tom, A.K.A Mr. Friendly A.K.A Zeke, hassle Ethan over not generating his list yet.
Maternity Leave shows us what happened immediately before “Homecoming”, the season one episode where Claire returned to camp and Charlie ultimately killed Ethan. The span of time was one day.
The ONLY logical conclusion is that Jacob and Ethan are two different people, and that Jacob infiltrated the 815′rs sometime after Ethan was killed. Which means, there is still an other amongst them. (I vote Paulo! Let’s kill him!)
Yeah I wondered who this “Jacob” is…I think its him but then we have said that about a fewe of the others so its an interesting thing…damn hiatus!!!
Comment by Damien — November 9, 2006 @ 4:11 pm
See, I tend to disagree that there is another “other”. The way I understood it was that Jacob was possibly “HIM” that Ben referred to earlier. And Jacob had a list of people Ben and his cronies were supposed to bring back. Remember Locke was supposed to be brought back.
Comment by lostiefan — November 9, 2006 @ 4:12 pm
But Tom’s (Zeke) conversation with Ethan FIRMLY establishes that it was Ethan’s responsibility to make the list. As did Ben’s conversation with him in Tale of Two Cities. This tells us that somebody has to be close to the group to make the list. Jacob is an unknown.
Comment by docarzt — November 9, 2006 @ 4:20 pm
Jacob was the other guy ben sent in the season debut episode, to go to where the tail section crashed and make a list.
Comment by Borgo — November 9, 2006 @ 4:39 pm
I was thinking it possible that Jacob is the eye-patch man and that he is the also surveying the people on the island, either through the monitors or through controlling “the monster”.
Comment by stinkfist0 — November 9, 2006 @ 4:41 pm
I agree with lostiefan, Jacob is HIM, and the list ehy are talking about is not the same lists that Ethan and Goodwin were supposed to write.
Comment by Andreas — November 9, 2006 @ 4:50 pm
Perhaps when Ehtan and Goodwin went to different points of the lostsies’ island, they must have kept in touch via a hidden walkie-talkie. In this case, JACOB Goodwin could be compiling the master list of names. Pickett seems to call people he doesn’t like by last name (”Shepherd”) and reserve first names for friends - Goodwin was just a last name, Jacob might have been a first name.
Comment by Leonado — November 9, 2006 @ 4:55 pm
I think Jacob is “Him” too. Ethan and Goodwin were just making initial lists. And we still don’t know what the listmaking thing is all about yet. Plus, it was firmly established that everyone on Hurley’s flight manifest was accounted for except for Ethan, and that Ethan was the only one Ben sent to that side of the island initially.
Comment by John Griffin — November 9, 2006 @ 4:55 pm
Heres the problem with your theory DocArtz. When the plane had just crashed probably no one on the island knew it was going to happen. An act of God. So immediately Ben springs into action. He sends Ethan and Goodwin to the camps to find out about these newcomers. So if there is another person above Ben then this other person wouldn’t have had the opportunity to tell Ben what to do. Later on Ethan seemed like he was going renegade. He cared too much about Claire. That is why Zeke was getting nervous. So its entirely possible that there is someone above Ben named Jacob who is controlling all of the events. Also as an interesting tidbit in the bible, Ben is the son of Jacob. With all the biblical refrences I would call this a possible clue.
Comment by Jalocke — November 9, 2006 @ 4:57 pm
found this on jacob
http://www.4815162342.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30835
Comment by kakerwhart — November 9, 2006 @ 5:01 pm
There’s been too much time spent on Ethan and Goodwin’s lists to think that there is ANOTHER list… it’s the same list, denoting the ‘good’ ones (whatever that means).
And Ben is Him. Even the actor is pretty sure he’s the leader. There’s been no mention of someone above him, and we’ve been spending too much time with the Others to think they just haven’t brought it up.
Still, though… how could another Other infiltrate their camp? Ignoring the manifest (someone could have taken the name of a dead person… Ethan really should have done that), we didn’t SEE Ben send a second person. I dunno. I think the theory of Jacob being Patchy, and investigating from afar via monitors in the Swan or using the Monster seems most likely.
Comment by Nick — November 9, 2006 @ 5:10 pm
I hope Jacob is Kelvin, Clacy Brown is to good of an actor to be dead, he so could have faked death. He was a military man who had a huge file on Sayid just like the others do on eeryone. Why would u put that person in a flashback episode of 2 people (sayid and desmond) not to mention ut him on the island. He was very sketchy, I think he might still be alive,he was a top notch miitary man that could gather info on people much like the others
Comment by charlie — November 9, 2006 @ 5:12 pm
Whoa… wait a minute guys… I love ya’s, but a second list? Jacob being him… why bother to send Ethan and Goodwin to write other “lists”? You lost fans can be so over analyzing…
Deal with what you know and the answer is plain… they needed to send an individual amongst the survivors to create a list. Ethan was whacked before making his list, so another individual was sent in after.
Comment by docarzt — November 9, 2006 @ 5:35 pm
Jacob Vanderfield is a member of the Board of Directors on the Hanso Foundation. His bio pic and Patches look similar. I tried posting the links to his pics, but it didn’t take for some reason.
Now his involment? I think he, like Kelvin, signed up for the initiative and got stuck in a hatch somewhere. He is a Hanso employee or was. I don’t think is exactly an “other”.
Comment by downthehatch — November 9, 2006 @ 6:34 pm
doc,
its very LOGICAL that Ethan & Goodwin made lists, and Jacob (HIM???) picked who the Others needed to take, after gathering information about each survivor.
and theres definitely not another infiltrator. if they used that storyline again, ppl would flip because it would be rehashed; been there, done that. when they checked the manifest hurley said theres ONE person not on the list, who we KNOW is Ethan.
1 - 1 = 0 remaining Others infiltrating the beach
Comment by redsix — November 9, 2006 @ 6:40 pm
1) Do we know for a fact that Ethan’s name is Ethan Rom? Could it be Ethan Jacob? Or Ethan Jacob Rom?
2) Could Jacob be a nickname for Ethan? (We’ve had enough of those on this show)
3) Maybe Jacob is the one who collected the lists from Goodwin and Ethan?
4) Presumably, Jacob is the guy who went in after Ethan was killed, someone we never saw.
Comment by jstu9 — November 9, 2006 @ 6:57 pm
Maybe the guys name is “Ethan Jacob”… he refers to Jack as “Sheppard”, why not “Ethan Jacob” as “Jacob”?
I don’t think there is a “HIM”, Ben was referring to himself…
Comment by DCLOOCHA — November 9, 2006 @ 7:04 pm
Keep it simple folks. What do we know: Ethan did not make a list. Therefore Ethan != Jacob.
Comment by docarzt — November 9, 2006 @ 8:12 pm
Can someone help me out on this one.
1. Ethan did not get his list completed. This we know.
2. Goodwin was able to make a list AND have other come for abduction pick up on the first night at the tail section crash correct?
So why did Ethan take so damn long to make his list if Goodwin was able to turn one around and bring other into action in less than a day?
Comment by Akbar Fazil — November 9, 2006 @ 8:33 pm
Guys, you’re all forgetting that there was another list that we’ve already heard about. When Goodwin is sitting with Ana Lucia right before she kills him, he says “Nathan wasn’t a good person. That’s why he wasn’t on the list”. Referring to the list of people that were taken by the Others, the “good ones”. Whoever this Jacob is, he made the list of the good ones. That’s the list we must be talking about.
Comment by Bunny Suction — November 9, 2006 @ 8:52 pm
Lost has shown itself to be anything but simple. “Ethan Jacob(s)” is quite plausible, especially considering the facts that Ethan and Goodwin were ordered to make lists and that he referred to Jack by his last name in the same sentence. definitely not the only possible logical conclusion…yeesh.
Comment by Grubby — November 9, 2006 @ 8:52 pm
Ethan did not finish his list. If he had, why bother to even introduce this information?
Comment by docarzt — November 9, 2006 @ 9:10 pm
Hmmm….I thought the “list” they were referring to was the list of crash survivors to bring back that Ms. Klugh gave to Michael. Jack wasn’t supposed to go with them, but because of the X-rays they took the week before (around the time Michael returned to the survivors with his list), Ben added him.
If it’s that list they’re talking about, then Jacob wanted two of the “bad” people to be delivered to him. For what purpose, though? I dunno.
Comment by aisorbma — November 9, 2006 @ 9:25 pm
Yeah, Ethan definately didn’t finish his list…let’s see…two hundred trillion people are swiped from the tailsection, bringing it form what…29 to like 5. Notice the only people taken from the fuselage are Claire and Charlie…Claire for her baby apparently, and Charlie is hung halfway to the snakey hatch. My theory: Jacob is probably patchy…but then how does patchy know they are watching him from the pearl? hmmmmm. Now, Jack Sawyer and Kate can’t be the “good ones” from the fuselage…we know Jack was taken to fix benry. Sawyer was NOT on jacob’s list, so we can either assume kate WAS or they just didn’t mention her. Oh, and Hurley must not be too important…they took him because they knew he’d carry the warning back to the plane-ers.
Comment by shawn — November 9, 2006 @ 10:42 pm
we haven’t seen the african chick from the fake huts in a while. wasn’t she one of the “main” others when dealing with michael?
Comment by cware — November 9, 2006 @ 11:01 pm
whether its Paulo or not i still say kill Paulo
Comment by CD — November 9, 2006 @ 11:01 pm
I interpreted as the list of the people the Others should bring back (the list Mrs Klugh gave Michael, with Jack Kate Sawyer and Hurley on it)
Comment by gww — November 9, 2006 @ 11:28 pm
Ethan was required to make a list of *all* passangers.
I, too, believe Jacob is ‘him’. I believe his original list was Sawyer, Kate and Hurley. He’s handed this list to Ben, who’s added Jack (to fix his spine) and handed it to Bea/Ms. Klugh.
The reason for just Kate and Sawyer? Who knows.
Comment by Bauer — November 10, 2006 @ 1:52 am
Okay, so here’s my thought: They’re in communication with the mainland somewhere - that’s how they have Jack’s file and other information. So, let’s say they contacted their mainland friend (Jacob) and said, “We have the survivors of Oceanic 815 on your island of mystery - who of these passengers is worthy of culling for our experiments?” Jack wasn’t on the list for whatever reason. If I go a step further - they’re interested in adding to the gene pool- I don’t think they can have babies of their own - so maybe there’s something genetically unacceptable about Jack or maybe he’s got a low sperm count.
Comment by pip — November 10, 2006 @ 2:41 am
i still wish we could have seen something related to penny so far this season. but we probably did ’see’ something just didn’t realize it. maybe the others contact to the outside world is through her, or those guys who were monitoring the buzzer thing. anyway, by far the best episode yet!
Comment by wifeofveux — November 10, 2006 @ 2:58 pm
Could it be that Jacob’s list refers to the people who were scheduled to be on Flight 815? ie, Jacob was the one who ’rounded up’ all the passengers? We know that Jack wasn’t meant to be on the flight - he had to beg the woman at the check-in desk to get on it. (And it would tie in with the ‘Jack was gonna die in the 1st episode’ stuff)
Comment by RichieV — November 10, 2006 @ 3:21 pm
Remember that there was a list of the people from the plane that Ethan had to gather the info about and then there is a list of the people that the others wanted. In addition, Ana Lucia had a list from the dead others that they killed. Jacob someone other than Ethan or Goodwin.
Paul
Comment by Paul — November 11, 2006 @ 12:32 am
In my opinion there is no problem with the lists.
The way I see it.
1. Plane Crashes
2. Ben and Others see the crash.
3. Ben sends Goodwin and Ethan to get lists of all the passengers. Everyone of them.
4. They deliver the messages back to Ben at the main camp.
5. Ben gives the names to Jacob.
6. Jacob gives Ben a list of the names of people he wants.
If Jacob is higher up then Ben then this would disqualify the argument that Ben’s first order’s to Ethan and Goodwin wouldn;t make sense if there was a “Him” higher than Ben.
This is how I see it.
Comment by Jalocke — November 11, 2006 @ 3:33 am
I think it’s funny how both of the leaders of the Others have Jewish names. Heyooo!! Can I say that? (Just kidding people!)
Comment by Anonymous — November 11, 2006 @ 3:53 am
Jacob’s List is created from data produced by the JACOB computer system.
Comment by Bob Bayer — November 12, 2006 @ 11:36 am
I can see Jacob turning out to be Sawyer.
It would take a great conman to stay in the group undetected, also it would have to be someone who wasn’t on the manifest. IIRC Hurley said at the time “Who the hell is James Ford” to which Sawyer said “I am”, it could easily have been someone who died in the tail section.
Everyone knew Jack has a soft spot for Kate so Sawyer moves in and gets Kate to fall for him, that way when all 3 are captured by the others they can get Sawyer to manipulate Kate into getting Jack to do what they want.
Comment by Matthew Allen — November 12, 2006 @ 6:54 pm
* He is JACOB VANDERFIELD, a member of the Hanso Foundation talked about the in the Hanso Foundation website
* He is PATCHY, you can tell from the photograph shown on the website
* He is HIM. I think he is the true leader of the Others and Ben is his right-hand man.
For more info on Vanderfield:
http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Jacob_Vanderfield
Comment by Valenzetti — November 12, 2006 @ 11:03 pm
I’m going with…
Ben isn’t the leader, although he does hold an authority position, Jacob is higher up the chain of command and ultimately issued the list of people to be brought back.
Ben added Jack to the list because of his tumor situ.
Eye patch man isn’t Jacob, and he’s not controlling the ‘monster’
my 2p for now
Comment by Matt Grover — November 13, 2006 @ 1:21 pm
Oh yeah and the other thing, that was illustrated in ep6..
Ben is Alex’s father, so that would imply that either..
a)Ben was part of Rousseu’s team and joined the others
or
b)Rousseau was originally an other.
Comment by Matt Grover — November 13, 2006 @ 1:29 pm
didnt ethan die in season 1?? or am i mistaken?? why would henry/ ben talk about HIM being so powerful when he was locked in the hatch if ethan/ him is dead??
Comment by andrea — November 13, 2006 @ 8:42 pm
I’m not sure if anyone’s called attention to this, but I’m pretty positive ol’ Patchy is ‘Radzinsky’. Remember in season two when the tailies bring Sawyer, Jin, and Micheal into the abandoned Arrow hatch. They find the bibel with the hidden compartment that reveals a GLASS EYE, and the edited orientation film. Remember Kelvin mentioned that Radzinsky made some ‘edits’.
Comment by Stev — November 15, 2006 @ 2:24 am
Bea Klugh also made a list (when Ben was trapped in the hatch)… Maybe Ben told then to include Jack when the Lockdown happened (using the computer).
Comment by bodom — November 16, 2006 @ 5:27 pm
When Tom says, Shepard wasn’t even on Jacob’s list, he wasn’t talking about some gofer’s list, he was talking about someone high up who had a list of people for Michael to bring back.
Comment by MEH — November 17, 2006 @ 2:30 am
Ben is Alex’s father, so that would imply that either
or (c) that Ben raised Alex after she was abducted. Alex may not know that she is Danielle’s daughter — she might oppose the Others because she is a “good person”.
I agree with the posters who speculate about Jacob’s list being the one that eventually made it into the hands of Michael via Ms. Klugh. It doesn’t really make sense otherwise. Why would Pickett refer to Ethan as “Jacob”?
Comment by dcs — November 21, 2006 @ 1:09 pm
Jacob is a CHILD.
Where are the children??
They are in control of an island that frives on imagination!!!
Comment by Jeff — December 9, 2006 @ 11:23 am
Ethan Rom is Jacob.
Ethan Rom can be an anagram for “Other Man”, “More Than”, and “The Roman”. Looking at those from all sides; there are the Losties and The Others, obviously, which covers the “Other Man”. Jacob is “More Than” human, and with all the analogies of the stations on the Island being related to Apollo, “the Roman” fits as well.
Ethan was noted to be the best surgeon The Others had, and Apollo was a god of religious or spiritual healing. And if you look at anybody being recruited, from Juliet to baby Aaron, Ethan was there. Ethan was the one making a list at the Losties beach, and nobody seems to refer to Ethans list, just Jacobs�
Also if you look at a picture of Ethan and the ONE shot of Jacob, the wide-bridged nose, soft-chinned profile fits the face. The name Jacob in reference to the Biblical character, was later known as Israel, which was also the name for the promised land, which the others seem to think the Island is�
Comment by xodiaq — June 4, 2007 @ 12:44 pm